Networking two computers together?



Would another hardrive be more advantageous than networking two computers together? (this ought to open up a can of worms)

squatch81 (16) on 08/11/99 at 12:25:17 PDT

Toycop.gif - Networking multiple computers is great! It helps solve conflicts (such as my scanner that doesn't like CDR drives or win98) and allows you to play head to head games, and ethernet cards and coax are cheap. I have 4 computers spread out over the house all networked together.

toycop.gif (22) on 08/11/99 at 12:34:11 PDT

The ethernet way doesn't need the hub right? And works off windows? Thought the UTP method use coax, does ethernet also? I have a base band processor that must have had something to do with networking, it has coax cable connections.

That head to head game concept with networking does sound like a treat, for today and the near future I'm just looking for backup. Was trying to figure out best method to send files from one computer to another since their is no send to port pick in where to send a file. Sounds like I could open them up and get some long wires out say the jumper cables out of the car and with careful grounding send the stuff thru the long ribbon like wires while the cases lay open. Next choice seems to be networking. Next seems to be cdrw/zip drive. Next seems to be another hard drive in same machine, and last but not least is a million more floppies!

squatch81 (16) on 08/11/99 at 12:47:45 PDT

eithernet 10/ base tx can use coax and doesn't need a hub. You are limited to 10 MBPS, but that is plenty fast for most things. Some cards are 10/100 and can go with coax or cat 5 cables (the ones that look like phone jack plugs). I love using the network to back up folders 'cause you are not limited by the 1.4MEG barrier on floppies.

captain-kirk (184) on 08/11/99 at 12:49:28 PDT

toycop: also depends on whether you want to back up your whole HD, so that you can restore your system "instantly", or whether it is OK to just back up your data, drivers, etc., such that a restore is a "reload windows and apps, then restore the data" kind of operation.

toycop.gif (22) on 08/11/99 at 13:00:18 PDT

I'm sure the "instantly restore" is going to cost more. I'm used to using Dariolius, it "opens up" the floppy so any size file can be stored on them, only limited by how many floppies one has and how many times one wants to put the next floppy in to copy to. Three or four aren't bad but getting to 12 or 22 floppies gets a little tedious and one begins to ponder about how useful a file was in the first place. Floppies do fine for small backups but not for a downloaded new browser, etc.

captain-kirk (184) on 08/11/99 at 13:06:08 PDT

toycop: making an "instant restore" means you have spare media equal in size to the contents of your HD, and that you consistently back it up, either manually or via some sort of software that is smart enough to figure out what has changed incrementally from the last backup. If I had a production system that needed to keep running 24X7, I'd have this.

At home, I just organize my data such that I can back up those files on a semi-frequent basis. I also have copies of any downloaded drivers, etc. Personally, I find that as long as my HD doesn't need reloading more than once a year, I can live with that, esp. since I get some side benefits (clean up all the junk that has accumulated along the way). My data files fit on a few floppies, so its easy enough for me to make backups.

toycop.gif (22) on 08/11/99 at 13:08:44 PDT

this coax cable, Is it much faster than the cat 5? Are we talking the old 59 cable or does it use the newer rg6 or some other size?

squatch81 (16) on 08/11/99 at 13:21:09 PDT

Using the COAX is slower than using a hub, but it took less than 1 min. to move a 150 Meg folder from one end of the house to the other.

The coax I use is RG-58/U. It had BNC connectors on the ends. *note* - you cannot hook the cables directly to your network cards. You need T connectors on your net cards and terminators on the ends of your network. When I started adding more computers to my network, I bought a 'kit' here on eBay that had the T's, terminators, and several cables of various lengths.

killam (40) on 08/11/99 at 13:37:29 PDT

The phone jack looking plugs on network card are RJ-45 plugs...
Capt'n, I saved a copy of the registry from day one back before any installs other than windows and a little OEM software. What's the difference in importing it vs. a hard drive format? captain-kirk (184) on 08/11/99 at 11:41:29 PDT

toycop: the infamous registry is a mini-database of programs, settings, file types, and all kinds of such info. If you restore this registry, your HD will still have all the current folders, programs, etc. it has on it. You might be OK, in that the registry would be valid, but it wouldn't know about recent programs, file types, etc., and you'd still have a HD full of junk.

A hard drive format (and reload) will keep the HD folders and registry in synch. It would be a much cleaner solution, although it will take longer of course. You'd end up with a clean registry and a clean HD.

How to network them myself most economically? I don't care if they are truly networked, just want to access the internet from more than one room. I have a USB hookup, so don't even have a network card on either machine right now. Aren't laptop network cards very $$$ ?

rickmentecky (91) on 08/11/99 at 15:20:53 PDT

fibo - It's not as difficult as it sounds. I have two desktops networked both sharing one modem.

You need: A Network adapter for each machine. My PCI ones cost $17. I saw some slick wireless jobbies at CompUSA, didn't catch the price. They were sold in pair and I believe they had a parallel port model. Windows 98 SE. It includes the network sharing. This was VERY easy to set up.

Between the network cards, cable and Win98 it cost me total less than $150.

rick ... that wireless thing sounds pretty kool for 2 desktops, but I think the laptop PCMCIA (?) card is a couple hundred bucks, but would I need a card with the USB connection? I guess I need a hub, splitter? So I would need a cable, coax, ?? to run up thru the attic I guess. bedroom is at far end of house, (naturally)! I have WIN 98 on both machines now. What is WIN98SE exactly? (SE=second edition ed.)

Networking two PC's



Could you please tell us what exactly we need to hook up and use two computers at once...can two computers be on the same internet deal.. and does the use of one affect the other's working ability...as you can tell we know zip... don't want to get the wrong stuff to do it...Thank you for your assistance...mazy

rmorrison (49) on 11/14/99 at 16:51:14 PST

Mazydaz --Yes, two computers can be hooked together to share a modem and be on the internet at the same time with little problem. how little problem depends on what you are using for operating system and your connection to the internet and what you are intending to use the computers for.

happtradr (8) on 11/14/99 at 16:51:31 PST

mazy We need a little more info to help you. 1) what kind of computers do you have? 2) What kind of ISP are you using? [phone, ISDN, cable, etc.] There will be add'tl questions, but those can help us get you started.

computerguy5 (5) on 11/14/99 at 16:52:46 PST

mazy... I guess some one came asking about my specialty!!! First off, you need two ethernet cards (10 base T are fine, and your local computer store should have them. the $20 ones are fine) and a Category 5 network cable (also referred to as cat 5, and make SURE that they say either "crossover" or "reversed" on it if you only want to hook two computers together and don't plan on hooking anymore together.) Then you put the ethernet cards into the computers (consult a local guru if you don't know how to do this) boot the computer and let windows find the cards, install the drivers, etc. from here it gets a bit more complicated, so when you have done this so far, come back. For the internet sharing part, you might want to buy some software at your local computer store called "Sygate" Haven't used it, but I hear that it works just as good as the proxy server that I use.

squatch81 (31) on 11/14/99 at 17:00:08 PST

mazydaz - A good way to connect several computers to one internet connection is with a webramp.
http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=197678435 Sorry, I got this one!

mazydaz (0) on 11/14/99 at 17:02:43 PST

I am copying all this so we don't mess up...the one computer is a Compaq and we were going to buy a HP for the second one...only because they are on sale...and the server is thru the phone lines...so if another brand of computer is better...we wanted find out for sure, naturally, before we bought the second computer.. since we are dumb as dumb....We appreciate you all taking the time to answer...mazy

computerguy5 (5) on 11/14/99 at 17:06:11 PST

mazy... then, the 2 comps. you will be using will be fine... I personally like ethernet networks because they are the least expensive and the most expandable (granted, they do take a little bit of know how, but its pretty easy to understand... try getting a book called "Teach yourself Networking Visually" It might help you out...)

toycop.gif (29) on 11/14/99 at 17:07:22 PST

if both putters have a USB port you can network thru USB using some software

mazydaz (0) on 11/14/99 at 17:16:31 PST

Two computers would be it...we are getting the other one because I pig up this one with the stuff for auctions.. and no one else gets to use it very much....making me unpopular...this computer has a USB...and that was a feature we were going for on the other one...I just took the Webramp tutorial...and do you need the cards with that...it didn't mention that.. or I missed it...I do very much appreciate the help........Yes it is windows 98.. mazy

squatch81 (31) on 11/14/99 at 17:21:20 PST

mazydaz - You do need to have network cards in your computers to use a Webramp. At a hamfest I was at this weekend I could have bought a truckload of network cards at $5.00 each

toycop.gif (29) on 11/14/99 at 17:23:24 PST

figured it was win98 since you have a USB port

here's some networking reading for later http://www.builder.com/Servers/Infrastructure/?tag=st.cn.sr1.dir.

rmorrison (49) on 11/14/99 at 17:23:54 PST

Mazydaz --Someone with Windows 98 will have to help you with this, but Win98 has built in support for what you want to do. I just don't know just what is needed to make it work. I think you can do it with a USB cable and then it is simple.

mazydaz (0) on 11/14/99 at 17:35:48 PST

Thank you all ...the USB sounds the really easiest.. if they were 20 or 25 feet apart...is that possible.. would the operation of one...mess up the other...and one would need the same type of cable.. catagory 5...to accomplish this...I cannot say enough how much I appreciate the assistance.. have been to radio shack.. not much help..you all have been way more...it is very much appreciated...mazy

iwbr (40) on 11/14/99 at 17:36:57 PST

I just have to drop my two cents in here.
Another program that will allow you to setup several PC's to share the internet is called Winroute, it's really easy to use. At both of our shops we use a computer running red hat Linux and do IP forwarding through that, the advantage of that is you can run a web server off of if and it's rather secure, it also makes it a lot harder for someone to get access to local files on your network because all the internal IP addresses are hidden.

rmorrison (49) on 11/14/99 at 17:42:08 PST

Mazydaz --If...If it can be done with USB, it requires a USB cable. I wish I knew more to help out, but I'm running Win95 which doesn't have the right stuff built in. I run 2 or 3 computers networked with 10baseT cards, Cat5 cables and Wingate software on a Pentium 100 computer with a Pentium 90 working off the proxy. It would take me about a week to get you running with that kind of setup using this chat board and emails (did last time) but eventually it would work.

computerguy5 (5) on 11/14/99 at 17:52:40 PST

mazy... www.tigerdirect.com has a kit... But I believe that the maximum USB cable length right now is 10' I could be wrong...

Pick your choice of Home Networking Tutorials:
http://www.altavista.com/cgi-bin/query?pg=q&sc=on&q=home+networking+tutorial&kl=XX&stype=stext

Belkin lists a USB cable at 20 feet now, so I guess that might be the limit.

happtradr (8) on 11/14/99 at 18:01:29 PST

Mazy I'm running Win98, have 2 IBM PC-type computers on 1 network. I bought NetGear 10baseT at Comp USA for <$100. I followed the directions in the box and am thrilled with the results. We share files, 2 printers, 2 PCs, and 1 Internet Service provider. Had it done in <4 hours. And that was Before I knew the terrific folks on this board!

toycop.gif (30) on 11/14/99 at 18:26:52 PST

Looks like Ron got farther on Belkins site than I did without that pamphlet since he found the 20' cable. I did find this: http://www.laplink.com/products/cables/overview.asp which talks about win95 USB support and takes you to here for a diagnostic: http://www.laplink.com/support/updates/default.asp?id=540&val=2 win 95 latest release test for USB Drivers with support for Windows 95 and 98 among other things.

parpat (3) on 11/14/99 at 18:29:02 PST

Ok.. who is the METRIC person ?? ..
USB Cable assemblies longer than 5 meters can cause malfunction of PCs, hubs and devices.
I believe it is the current spec.. not for the upcoming.. try www.usb.org ..
Requirements for USB compliant cable assemblies USB Implementers Forum USB promises end-users the ability to hot-attach peripherals and adapters … an evolutionary next step in plug-and-play expansion without opening the box. To deliver on this promise, device and interconnect providers need to adhere to a few simple rules. It's like designing with Lego blocks.
The pieces need to follow a common set of rules so that they plug together consistently. The USB Lego pieces consist of hubs, cables and devices. These pieces plug together seamlessly to form permissible topologies. A particular area of concern to the USB-IF is cable assemblies.

USB cables must adhere to the following specifications:
1. No more than 5 meters long. Cable assemblies longer than 5 meters can cause malfunction of PCs, hubs and devices. Cable assemblies may be provided in lengths less than 5 meters.
2. Rated for 500mA current. Cable assemblies rated for less than the full 500mA rating may overheat when used with certain hubs and devices.
3. Have one A-plug and one B-plug. Cable assemblies with two A-plugs, with an A-socket, or with a B-socket may cause PCs, hubs, and devices to malfunction or overheat.
4. Be adequately shielded. Lack of shielding may cause malfunction of PCs, hubs and devices.
Note: There is only one kind of USB cable assembly, the correct kind. A USB cable assembly is to be used with devices or hubs that have B-sockets. USB cable assemblies should not be used to "extend"

rmorrison (50) on 11/14/99 at 19:13:58 PST

Mazydaz according to the article on Internet Connection Sharing from Microsoft, you have to have a network card in each computer and connected with the proper cable to use the sharing. Click here to read about it: http://support.microsoft.com/support/kb/articles/Q234/8/63.ASP

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